Phil wants to open up Xbox to Steam/Epic, eliminate exclusives

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SolidGame_basic

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#1 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 45222 Posts

https://www.polygon.com/24108670/xbox-epic-games-store-phil-spencer-interview

In an interview with Microsoft’s CEO of Gaming during the annual Game Developers Conference, Spencer told Polygon about the ways he’d like to break down the walled gardens that have historically limited players to making purchases through the first-party stores tied to each console. Or, in layperson terms, why you should be able to buy games from other stores on Xbox — not just the official storefront.

Spencer mentioned his frustrations with closed ecosystems, so we asked for clarity. Could he really see a future where stores like Itch.io and Epic Games Store existed on Xbox? Was it just a matter of figuring out mountains of paperwork to get there?

“Yes,” said Spencer. “[Consider] our history as the Windows company. Nobody would blink twice if I said, ‘Hey, when you’re using a PC, you get to decide the type of experience you have [by picking where to buy games]. There’s real value in that.” Spencer believes console players would benefit from that freedom too — and so would console makers like Microsoft.

Spencer explained how, in the past, console makers would typically subsidize the cost of expensive hardware, knowing that a portion of every dollar spent on games for the platform over the years would eventually make it back to the console maker. Then, in time, the console maker would recoup the subsidy — and hopefully more.

But, Spencer said, “Moore’s Law has slowed down. The price of the components of a console aren’t coming down as fast as they have in previous generations.” Worse, he explained, the console market isn’t growing, with more gamers moving to PC and handheld options. Now, the notion of subsidizing a console — and forcing players to purchase games through the official storefront to help recoup costs — might not make sense. The walls meant to lock people into consoles might be motivating them to stay out.

“[Subsidizing hardware] becomes more challenging in today’s world,” Spencer said. “And I will say, and this may seem too altruistic, I don’t know that it’s growing the industry. So I think, what are the barriers? What are the things that create friction in today’s world for creators and players? And how can we be part of opening up that model?”

The answer, in part, is scrapping exclusivity on more and more Xbox games. Spencer explained that the game experience is hindered when it matters what consoles we play on or what shops sell us our games. As an example, he pointed to Sea of Thieves. A player, he explained, shouldn’t have to worry about what hardware they or their friends own. They should just know if their friends have and want to play Sea of Thieves.

Now, Spencer said, “if I want to play on a gaming PC, then I feel like I’m more a continuous part of a gaming ecosystem as a whole. As opposed to [on console], my gaming is kind of sharded — to use a gaming term — based on these different closed ecosystems that I have to play across.”

Spencer’s view sounds reasonable on paper. The console market is flat. The PC market is growing in part because it gives players a choice in where they buy games. So, if consoles want to bring players back, they’ll need to be more like PCs. And that means bringing down the walled gardens that, for decades, have protected the financial model of game consoles.

If Spencer wants to make that vision a reality, then it’s reasonable that we could one day boot up our Xboxes and see Epic Games Store, Itch.io, and other shops waiting to sell us games — and hopefully competing with one another to bring players the best possible deals.

Thoughts, SW? Do you think consoles will eventually go that route? Or is Phil adopting this position because Xbox is losing? I’ve seen this argument before, but when you look at Nintendo, they are anti open anything and are massively successful.

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Mesome713

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#2 Mesome713
Member since 2019 • 7213 Posts

We want everyone else to have a chance to put us out of business. - Phil

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blaznwiipspman1

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#3 blaznwiipspman1
Member since 2007 • 16562 Posts

@SolidGame_basic: I agree with him. Nintendo is more of a special case. The switch was successful because it's a handheld / console. That special hardware attracted audiences, and Nintendo capitalized. People say hardware doesn't sell software, that is something I disagree on. Hardware can definitely sell software, it doesn't mean power specifically but maybe some sort of gimmick that captures people's imagination.

That's largely where Xbox failed in the console space. Look at the ps5, with its wierd router like design, and curves. They even pumped up the dual sense controller as the next big thing. The Xbox was a box with a controller. No real imagination, because what they sold people on is the promise of the platform. I don't think that's the wrong way to go about it...because the Xbox platform, and gamepass has made both the ps5 and switch largely irrelevant. Logically, its just not worth spending thousands of $$ to play on ps5 or switch. But, people are emotional, not Logical lol.

I would say that uncle Phil should pull out a gimmick from his ass for next xbox, but that goes against what Xbox and uncle Phil philosophy.

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uninspiredcup

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#4 uninspiredcup
Member since 2013 • 59062 Posts

If Microsoft keeps this bum they are doomed.

It's a competition not a hippy commune you big chinned baffoon!

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Pedro

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#5 Pedro  Online
Member since 2002 • 69680 Posts

More options are good for digital.

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Last_Lap

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#6 Last_Lap
Member since 2023 • 6187 Posts

Phil is a fucking idiot, it's nice to see others here finally starting to see that, while others not so much.

I've been championing for Phil to get fired for years, and yet some people here think he's a great guy and done a great job 🤦‍♂️

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#7 GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 1104 Posts

It's one way to go.

I'm curious if this means MS doesn't think 30% is enough to subsidize Xbox? I wonder why they didn't consider more appropriate specs for the price point? I realize they already raised the price of the Xbox at one point but maybe they didn't do it enough?

It seems like they are choosing another direction, and it does sound exciting to have a console experience with Steam, but I wonder how MS will tackle their problems with this direction. I'm not sure how it will help MS subsidize the hardware, unless they also plan on taking a 30% cut on top of the other digital stores' cut, but then won't this drive up the price of games on Xbox?

It's an interesting idea in theory but I wonder how they do it in practice in light of the issues they have already raised about their console offerings.

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Archangel3371

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#8 Archangel3371  Online
Member since 2004 • 44265 Posts

Sounds good to me and it kind of seems like it’s the way the market is heading anyway. Definitely better for the consumer so since I’m a consumer I’m all for it.

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Sam3231

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#9  Edited By Sam3231
Member since 2008 • 2958 Posts

I really see nothing wrong with Xbox's current ecosystem that it somehow needs to include games from Steam and Epic.

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sealionact

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#10 sealionact
Member since 2014 • 9822 Posts

@last_lap: You’ve been pleading for him to leave Xbox, and if you continue for years more I’m sure he will at some point. They all do.

He’s done a brilliant job in expanding Xbox. He could have gone down the Sony route and make another box reliant on exclusives, but as recent figures and releases on ps5 show….those days are behind us. Sony are now trying to match Xbox with GAAS games and PC gaming but Xbox has too much of a head start.

Sony have to change their model - Xbox is already doing it.

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DaVillain

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#11 DaVillain  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 56192 Posts

I think both Phil & Jim can team up to put a stop to making exclusives altogether:

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GhostOfGolden

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#12 GhostOfGolden
Member since 2023 • 2531 Posts

- Phil gets in front of a camera/mic and promises his base the world.

- Nothing happens

- Doom and gloom articles come out

- Repeat

Steam has been keeping Xbox on PC afloat. Of course Phil wants to have more folks doing his job for him.

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Last_Lap

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#13 Last_Lap
Member since 2023 • 6187 Posts

@sealionact: Dude c'mon take those Phil Spencer Pyjamas off.

He has been the worst gaming ceo in Xbox's history. How can you sit there and say he's done a brilliant job of expanding Xbox, that's the biggest lie I've read on here this year.

Xbox is failing hard because of Phil's inability to compete with Sony, he's such a failure that he's now dumping games on every platform including PS5, that not expanding Xbox, that's slowly killing it.

When will you hardcore lems wake up to reality?

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sakaiXx

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#14 sakaiXx
Member since 2013 • 15940 Posts

.. and cannibalizing Xbox storefronts!? Heh understandable, xbox users don't buy games.

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BenjaminBanklin

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#15 BenjaminBanklin
Member since 2004 • 11126 Posts

So basically MS is looking into making Xbox branded PC boxes? Nevermind they'd be cutting themselves out of tons of revenue by allowing Steam/Epic on their platform, making the Xbox game store useless, and Game Pass being niche as ever. I don't know who's calling the shots over there, but I feel like all their decisions are based on an AI randomizer now

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firedrakes

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#16 firedrakes
Member since 2004 • 4381 Posts

@last_lap said:

@sealionact: Dude c'mon take those Phil Spencer Pyjamas off.

He has been the worst gaming ceo in Xbox's history. How can you sit there and say he's done a brilliant job of expanding Xbox, that's the biggest lie I've read on here this year.

Xbox is failing hard because of Phil's inability to compete with Sony, he's such a failure that he's now dumping games on every platform including PS5, that not expanding Xbox, that's slowly killing it.

When will you hardcore lems wake up to reality?

checks sales numbers of only on this (insert which ever one)platform.... tend to do very poorly now with balloon budgets.

Fun facts last. most ps5 games that was not

4 out of the 6 games that has the most sold/ship

on ps5 are multi plat.

most ps5 games by sales numbers...

not even crack a million sold.

Your mind set a bad one for gaming

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hardwenzen

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#17 hardwenzen
Member since 2005 • 39109 Posts

Never have we seen someone who wants to kill off the Xbox brand as much as Phil. At this point i am beginning to think he is an undercover Sony employee.

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Antwan3K

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#18 Antwan3K
Member since 2005 • 8141 Posts

options are good..

being able to access your digital libraries from more endpoints is good..

yet somehow, in fanboyland, all that is bad.. 🙄

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Pedro

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#19  Edited By Pedro  Online
Member since 2002 • 69680 Posts
@Antwan3K said:

options are good..

being able to access your digital libraries from more endpoints is good..

yet somehow, in fanboyland, all that is bad.. 🙄

You must prioritize the revenue stream of a 3 trillion dollar company and what is in their best interest. This should be the number concern when gaming. Only a true gamer understands this and it clear you are not.😏

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Last_Lap

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#20  Edited By Last_Lap
Member since 2023 • 6187 Posts

@Antwan3K: What is it like in fanboyland, or should I say philsfanboyland?

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Nirgal

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#21  Edited By Nirgal
Member since 2019 • 692 Posts

The walled garden is how consoles make money. If the product can be sold through steam, then valve gets a cut for every game sold, not Microsoft.

Also if you are getting the steam version, it's not optimized specially for your console, so you loose the console optimization Performance premium.

At that point, it becomes just another steam console. (AKA a PC)

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Pedro

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#22 Pedro  Online
Member since 2002 • 69680 Posts

@nirgal said:

The walled garden is how consoles make money. If the product can be sold through steam, then valve gets a cut for every game sold, not Microsoft.

Also of you are getting the steam version, it's not optimized specially for your console, so you loose the console optimization Performance premium.

At that point, it becomes just another steam console.

Can you explain the bold?

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LuxuryHeart

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#23 LuxuryHeart
Member since 2017 • 1871 Posts

To a certain extent, I agree. I don't like when people pay successful third party companies for exclusives. It's scummy. You're just paying to keep that game from the competition.

Though I don't think first party exclusives are a bad thing. I like having games that differentiate which console to buy. It keeps the platform maker on their toes.

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Last_Lap

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#24 Last_Lap
Member since 2023 • 6187 Posts

@luxuryheart said:

To a certain extent, I agree. I don't like when people pay successful third party companies for exclusives. It's scummy. You're just paying to keep that game from the competition.

Though I don't think first party exclusives are a bad thing. I like having games that differentiate which console to buy. It keeps the platform maker on their toes.

Be careful with that kinda talk around these parts, some people on here think that all first party games no matter who makes them should be available on every other platform 🤦‍♂️

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UItravioIence

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#25 UItravioIence
Member since 2016 • 3036 Posts

What a cool 3rd party developer Microsoft is!

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R4gn4r0k

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#26 R4gn4r0k
Member since 2004 • 46441 Posts

@luxuryheart said:

To a certain extent, I agree. I don't like when people pay successful third party companies for exclusives. It's scummy. You're just paying to keep that game from the competition.

Though I don't think first party exclusives are a bad thing. I like having games that differentiate which console to buy. It keeps the platform maker on their toes.

Yeah you're paying to let less people have access to a game.

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Saint-George

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#27 Saint-George
Member since 2023 • 1280 Posts

So is it games or profits narrative this week,with so much flip flopping it's hard to remember

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sonny2dap

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#28 sonny2dap
Member since 2008 • 2073 Posts

@nirgal said:

The walled garden is how consoles make money. If the product can be sold through steam, then valve gets a cut for every game sold, not Microsoft.

Also if you are getting the steam version, it's not optimized specially for your console, so you loose the console optimization Performance premium.

At that point, it becomes just another steam console. (AKA a PC)

I know this is going to shock a lot of users on this board but you know that thing labelled PlayStation or Xbox, yeah that's just a gimped PC, I know shocking revelation to some.

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KvallyX

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#29 KvallyX
Member since 2019 • 13019 Posts

@SolidGame_basic said:

https://www.polygon.com/24108670/xbox-epic-games-store-phil-spencer-interview

In an interview with Microsoft’s CEO of Gaming during the annual Game Developers Conference, Spencer told Polygon about the ways he’d like to break down the walled gardens that have historically limited players to making purchases through the first-party stores tied to each console. Or, in layperson terms, why you should be able to buy games from other stores on Xbox — not just the official storefront.

Spencer mentioned his frustrations with closed ecosystems, so we asked for clarity. Could he really see a future where stores like Itch.io and Epic Games Store existed on Xbox? Was it just a matter of figuring out mountains of paperwork to get there?

“Yes,” said Spencer. “[Consider] our history as the Windows company. Nobody would blink twice if I said, ‘Hey, when you’re using a PC, you get to decide the type of experience you have [by picking where to buy games]. There’s real value in that.” Spencer believes console players would benefit from that freedom too — and so would console makers like Microsoft.

Spencer explained how, in the past, console makers would typically subsidize the cost of expensive hardware, knowing that a portion of every dollar spent on games for the platform over the years would eventually make it back to the console maker. Then, in time, the console maker would recoup the subsidy — and hopefully more.

But, Spencer said, “Moore’s Law has slowed down. The price of the components of a console aren’t coming down as fast as they have in previous generations.” Worse, he explained, the console market isn’t growing, with more gamers moving to PC and handheld options. Now, the notion of subsidizing a console — and forcing players to purchase games through the official storefront to help recoup costs — might not make sense. The walls meant to lock people into consoles might be motivating them to stay out.

“[Subsidizing hardware] becomes more challenging in today’s world,” Spencer said. “And I will say, and this may seem too altruistic, I don’t know that it’s growing the industry. So I think, what are the barriers? What are the things that create friction in today’s world for creators and players? And how can we be part of opening up that model?”

The answer, in part, is scrapping exclusivity on more and more Xbox games. Spencer explained that the game experience is hindered when it matters what consoles we play on or what shops sell us our games. As an example, he pointed to Sea of Thieves. A player, he explained, shouldn’t have to worry about what hardware they or their friends own. They should just know if their friends have and want to play Sea of Thieves.

Now, Spencer said, “if I want to play on a gaming PC, then I feel like I’m more a continuous part of a gaming ecosystem as a whole. As opposed to [on console], my gaming is kind of sharded — to use a gaming term — based on these different closed ecosystems that I have to play across.”

Spencer’s view sounds reasonable on paper. The console market is flat. The PC market is growing in part because it gives players a choice in where they buy games. So, if consoles want to bring players back, they’ll need to be more like PCs. And that means bringing down the walled gardens that, for decades, have protected the financial model of game consoles.

If Spencer wants to make that vision a reality, then it’s reasonable that we could one day boot up our Xboxes and see Epic Games Store, Itch.io, and other shops waiting to sell us games — and hopefully competing with one another to bring players the best possible deals.

Thoughts, SW? Do you think consoles will eventually go that route? Or is Phil adopting this position because Xbox is losing? I’ve seen this argument before, but when you look at Nintendo, they are anti open anything and are massively successful.

Well PS is losing too. Now you know why Sony is going multiplatform.

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SolidGame_basic

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#30 SolidGame_basic
Member since 2003 • 45222 Posts

@kvallyx: nope, PS5 is up 3-1 against Xbox, try again! 😊

https://www.ign.com/articles/ps5-has-outsold-xbox-series-x-and-s-3-to-1-in-2023-new-data-reveals

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WitIsWisdom

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#31 WitIsWisdom
Member since 2007 • 9574 Posts

I've been saying it for a while now, consoles will eventually merge their marketplaces with steam, epic, etc. It's only a matter of time. With diminishing returns and consoles and PC being more alike than ever before its just going to keep heading in that direction.

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Lavamelon

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#32 Lavamelon
Member since 2016 • 849 Posts

How does this make any sense? Microsoft won’t make any money from Steam or Epic Games Store sales. Plus they already have placed their games on Steam. So what is this about? I’m sure there is more to the story than this.

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SecretPolice

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#33  Edited By SecretPolice
Member since 2007 • 44129 Posts

Xbox's Uncle Phil the worldwide trend setter 24/7/365. Who da man eh? ;o

Poo cows. lol :P

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TheEroica

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#34 TheEroica  Moderator
Member since 2009 • 22734 Posts

@Antwan3K said:

options are good..

being able to access your digital libraries from more endpoints is good..

yet somehow, in fanboyland, all that is bad.. 🙄

This....

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lamprey263

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#35 lamprey263
Member since 2006 • 44589 Posts

I think a start in right direction would be a move to push entitlement bridging.

Curious what it would do for games that are published on Steam/EGS that are omitted from Xbox consoles through exclusivity deals.

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#36  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 1104 Posts

@lavamelon: Yeah. It doesn't seem clear how letting people buy from Steam and EGS and GOG will help solve the problem Phil raised about MS having difficulty subsidizing Xbox hardware.

It seems like in order to recover the $100-$200 loss on every Xbox sold they may need to either lower the cost of the hardware by selecting more appropriate components, increase the price of the hardware, and/or tax the sales from Steam etc which could increase the price of games.

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shellcase86

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#37 shellcase86
Member since 2012 • 6851 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@lavamelon: Yeah. It doesn't seem clear how letting people buy from Steam and EGS and GOG will help solve the problem Phil raised about MS having difficulty subsidizing Xbox hardware.

It seems like in order to recover the $100-$200 loss on every Xbox sold they may need to either lower the cost of the hardware by selecting more appropriate components, increase the price of the hardware, and/or tax the sales from Steam etc which could increase the price of games.

I doubt they're losing that much on each unit. It's got to be lower, if Sony is able to sell the PS5 at profit for over a year now, no?

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#38  Edited By GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 1104 Posts

@shellcase86: Maybe it has changed but this is what Microsoft has said according to GameSpot.

Spencer disclosed that Microsoft subsidizes the production cost of a new Xbox by about $100 to $200 per console.

According to OP, MS said:

"The price of the components of a console aren’t coming down as fast as they have in previous generations."

It would be nice to get an update on this, as well as how MS thinks adding other stores will help them recuperate any loss on hardware sales.

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dabear

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#39 dabear
Member since 2002 • 8870 Posts

@SolidGame_basic: I think consoles have an end of life as a closed ecosystem device, yes.

I see consoles being like a Mac Mini in the future, but with a more limited OS.

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R4gn4r0k

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#40 R4gn4r0k
Member since 2004 • 46441 Posts

@girlusocrazy said:

@shellcase86: Maybe it has changed but this is what Microsoft has said according to GameSpot.

Spencer disclosed that Microsoft subsidizes the production cost of a new Xbox by about $100 to $200 per console.

According to OP, MS said:

"The price of the components of a console aren’t coming down as fast as they have in previous generations."

It would be nice to get an update on this, as well as how MS thinks adding other stores will help them recuperate any loss on hardware sales.

Yeah they can't

  • AND suffer losses on each console sold
  • AND suffer losses from putting their own first/second party on game pass
  • AND suffer losses from putting third party on game pass

Because that doesn't sound like a healthy business plan at all.

What is gonna pay for the software losses? The hardware

Ok, and what is gonna pay for the hardware losses? The software!

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DaVillain

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#41 DaVillain  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 56192 Posts

I had to come back to this thread and with all the talk of Xbox opening itself up to PC launchers, it got me thinking about something. How the hell would Xbox handle modern AAA PC games in terms of RAM? 16GB for Xbox Series X and 10GB for the Xbox Series S would be in my mind a big bottleneck. I’ve seen the Steam Deck fully use up 16GB during 720p!

It's a good thing I have 32GB RAM as its now the main standard. 16GB has aged poorly😔

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SecretPolice

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#42 SecretPolice
Member since 2007 • 44129 Posts

@davillain said:

I had to come back to this thread and with all the talk of Xbox opening itself up to PC launchers, it got me thinking about something. How the hell would Xbox handle modern AAA PC games in terms of RAM? 16GB for Xbox Series X and 10GB for the Xbox Series S would be in my mind a big bottleneck. I’ve seen the Steam Deck fully use up 16GB during 720p!

It's a good thing I have 32GB RAM as its now the main standard. 16GB has aged poorly😔

No problem....

Cloud powah baby!!! lol :P

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sonny2dap

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#43 sonny2dap
Member since 2008 • 2073 Posts

@davillain said:

I had to come back to this thread and with all the talk of Xbox opening itself up to PC launchers, it got me thinking about something. How the hell would Xbox handle modern AAA PC games in terms of RAM? 16GB for Xbox Series X and 10GB for the Xbox Series S would be in my mind a big bottleneck. I’ve seen the Steam Deck fully use up 16GB during 720p!

It's a good thing I have 32GB RAM as its now the main standard. 16GB has aged poorly😔

Drops in res, frames, maybe shadows and texture quality too. I'm still running 16GB, no you are not doing 4k @ 100FPS, but 1080p at 60 fps is normally doable depending on software optimisation.

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Litchie

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#44  Edited By Litchie
Member since 2003 • 34655 Posts
@lavamelon said:

Microsoft won’t make any money from Steam or Epic Games Store sales.

Huh? Of course they would. They currently are.

@lavamelon said:

Plus they already have placed their games on Steam. So what is this about? I’m sure there is more to the story than this.

It's about being able to access Steam or EGS through an Xbox. I think? I didn't read either..

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Antwan3K

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#45  Edited By Antwan3K
Member since 2005 • 8141 Posts
@last_lap said:

@Antwan3K: What is it like in fanboyland, or should I say philsfanboyland?

You tell me..

You're calling for the firing of Phil Spencer when under his leadership, Xbox is #1 in monthly-active-users, is #2 in gaming revenue, has the largest 1st party presence (across Xbox Game Studios, Bethesda, and Activison/Blizzard), provides the most options for Day One content across consoles, PC, cloud, and subscription via Game Pass, and the list goes on..

Before Phil Spencer, Xbox was a sub-division of the Windows and Device group (run by Terry Myerson) and was an afterthought at Microsoft.. After Phil Spencer, Xbox has been promoted to a core division at Microsoft and is generating more revenue than Windows..

The reality is that, without Phil Spencer, Xbox was going to be either shutdown or sold off by Satya Nadella ala Windows Phone after the disaster of the Xbox One launch..

So please stop with the fanboy nonsense.. I know, I know, you want Xbox to be still fighting the console war.. But the war was over before Phil took charge.. There's nothing Xbox was going to do to stop the dominance of the PS4 after Don Mattrick and Terry Myerson ran the brand into the ground.. There was nothing Xbox could do to stop those PS4 owners from carrying over their digital libraries with a PS5 purchase..

Phil took that doomed ship and made a complete turnaround.. give credit where credit is due..

Xbox is now arguably leading the way in terms of overall gaming ecosystems across consoles, PC, cloud, and mobile (a strategy that Playstation has made clear they want to focus on moving forward)..

Please exit fanboyland and join the rest of us in the real world..

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osan0

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#46 osan0
Member since 2004 • 17833 Posts

Hmm. I saw there that Apple and the Fed are going to have a ding dong over Apples business practices and it's walled garden. I wonder if MS are thinking "consoles are next". If things don't go Apples way then Nintendo and Sony may also be forced to open their consoles up. The EU also seems to be thinking along similar lines...they and Apple are already at loggerheads.

Mabe just tin foil hot stuff on my part :P. Setting that aside:

I think he is only really speaking for Xbox rather than the industry as a whole. The whole console business...let's call a spade a spade...it hasn't worked for them. The fact he is still thinking about how much power he can cram in a box for $X means i don't think MS really gets it. They are on their 4th console and, really, only one of them was fairly successful (Even then, still soundly beaten). I mean their answer now seems to be "make them like PCs". That can be nice for existing Xbox Series owners but....why get an Xbox then?

In saying that it's great for us. I'm all on board having all games available on all systems as much as possible. Hopefully the US and EU get their way and these walled gardens can, at the very least, have shorter walls.

If MS really want to grow the Xbox business though then they need content. It's the one thing MS dont really seem to talk about. To very loosely paraphrase Steve Ballmer: CONTENT CONTENT CONTENT CONTENT CONTENT CONTENT.... And not amount of content, they have no shortage there, but the right content. Compelling content. System seller content. MS have a serious content problem. I can think of only 1 game they released that was received positively (Hi Fi Rush). A lot of the devs they spent billions on have been delivering meh.

Games sell hardware and services. If you don't have the right content then your platform, whether it's a console or a services, is useless. It's going nowhere.

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GirlUSoCrazy

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#47 GirlUSoCrazy
Member since 2015 • 1104 Posts

@osan0: Microsoft is 100% thinking about that

It's an interesting direction, but it seems to lead to each content provider having their own store, similar to how each content provider has split off from Netflix and siloed their content into their own service and now there are many to subscribe to.

Here they are talking about different stores to make purchases from. This could lead to each store having their own user agreements, their own terms regarding keeping titles available for download, what happens to your purchase if a licensing issue comes up, refund policies, how you can pay, who handles your payment info, how you can contest charges, what third parties get your data, etc.

I wonder how the experience will be for the end user.

I had a terrible experience with my Quest. At first I was using it just for Steam Link, but I tried using some native apps. At one point we were asked to scan and submit personal ID so they could verify who we were, and there was no opt-out. If we didn't do it, they would close the account and cancel any purchases made. Luckily I didn't make any. Recently they also stated they would start adding telemetry. I sold my Quest because of this terrible experience.

If this was a store on a console then someone could be out some $$$ if they don't submit to the terms of the shop. And if it's say Ubisoft and a UPlay store, maybe that's the only place you could buy new Ubisoft games, then your only choice would be to not buy their games.

The way things are now, if you don't like the way one platform or store does it, you can pick another. Some people only want to buy on Steam because they're reliable. If you can't do that anymore and content creators start holding their content exclusively in their store, then you might not get to shop around for things like price, or terms of service.

In that sense, it could end up that this creates less competition in some sense, even if there is more competition in another sense.

I wonder if things will end up better or worse overall if things go in this direction.

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Heil68

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#48 Heil68
Member since 2004 • 60718 Posts

Xbox on life supprt.

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Last_Lap

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#49 Last_Lap
Member since 2023 • 6187 Posts

@Antwan3K said:
@last_lap said:

@Antwan3K: What is it like in fanboyland, or should I say philsfanboyland?

You tell me..

You're calling for the firing of Phil Spencer when under his leadership, Xbox is #1 in monthly-active-users, is #2 in gaming revenue, has the largest 1st party presence (across Xbox Game Studios, Bethesda, and Activison/Blizzard), provides the most options for Day One content across consoles, PC, cloud, and subscription via Game Pass, and the list goes on..

Before Phil Spencer, Xbox was a sub-division of the Windows and Device group (run by Terry Myerson) and was an afterthought at Microsoft.. After Phil Spencer, Xbox has been promoted to a core division at Microsoft and is generating more revenue than Windows..

The reality is that, without Phil Spencer, Xbox was going to be either shutdown or sold off by Satya Nadella ala Windows Phone after the disaster of the Xbox One launch..

So please stop with the fanboy nonsense.. I know, I know, you want Xbox to be still fighting the console war.. But the war was over before Phil took charge.. There's nothing Xbox was going to do to stop the dominance of the PS4 after Don Mattrick and Terry Myerson ran the brand into the ground.. There was nothing Xbox could do to stop those PS4 owners from carrying over their digital libraries with a PS5 purchase..

Phil took that doomed ship and made a complete turnaround.. give credit where credit is due..

Xbox is now arguably leading the way in terms of overall gaming ecosystems across consoles, PC, cloud, and mobile (a strategy that Playstation has made clear they want to focus on moving forward)..

Please exit fanboyland and join the rest of us in the real world..

What a load of Phil fanboy loving garbage. When you create an ecosystem, it's your job to look after that ecosystem. Spencer has done the exact opposite of that. Putting games on PC, Switch, Playstation is not how you do that.

You do that by treating your loyal customers first. If you create a gaming device (Xbox) it's your job to make sure that it sells and Spencer has done everything except that.

This not about being a fanboy, that's just an excuse you're labelling me to stick up for Phil's failures.

Spencer just refuses to compete in the console market that he will try anything to not compete.

Either Spencer needs to go, or Xbox consoles need to go third party as Phil is treating Xbox and its loyal customers like garbage.

Maybe SW needs to add a new fanboy category Philsfanboys. Some of you are crazy to think Phil Spencer has done a great job.

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DaVillain

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#50 DaVillain  Moderator
Member since 2014 • 56192 Posts

@SecretPolice: You know, I forgot you can just download more Ram...even during lighting storms form Da Clouds😅

@sonny2dap said:

Drops in res, frames, maybe shadows and texture quality too. I'm still running 16GB, no you are not doing 4k @ 100FPS, but 1080p at 60 fps is normally doable depending on software optimisation.

It's just crazy to see RAM being used so much these days, I never thought we'd be hitting the limits soon. If MS can get better programmers and such, I don't see this becoming an issue.